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radeon 5970 help

Post Date: 2010-08-11
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robs180 View Drop Down
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Posts: 23 		  Quote robs180 Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Topic: radeon 5970 help
    Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 12:55pm
hello everyone, can someone explain to me what the difference is between the radeon 5970 2bg card and the 5970 4 gb card? like obviously its got double the video memory but im looking online and can't find much info on it.  everything i do find is about the 2gb card.. is it literally just 2 5970 2gb cards glued together? also does anyone know how well it preforms? and if it could out do 2 gtx 480's in sli? and help of links to websites would be appreciated.

thanks.
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Posts: 4219 		  Quote !ender_ Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 1:20pm
5970 2gb = 2 x downclocked 5870s
5970 4gb = overclocked and overvolted 5970 with 2gb vram ddr5 added
 
not overly useful to oversaturate vram like that.. all it really does is help with big worlds that are constantly kept "alive" such as in GTA4 and probably just cause2
 
there is an increase in overall performance from the 2gb to the 4gb version to be sure, but the 4gb one costs as much as
 
the toxic 5970 4gb is $200 more than 2 gtx 480s, which only starts the list of why it cant compare, not to mention the toxic is already overclocked to the ceiling, while the 480s can still be overclocked
 
you can actually see 2x470s beat the 5970 4gb in several cases, which is almost $500 less
 
keep in mind also that the 5970 4gb suggesests a minumum 850w PSU
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robs180 View Drop Down
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Posts: 23 		  Quote robs180 Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 2:23pm
so what your saying is its basically 2 older cards smashed together and OC to the nuts with some extra ram. good to know. so if gtx 470's  or 480's can outperform a 5970 4gb without being OC and costing 200$ or more less then why would anyone get it? it seems like the GTX cards are better and cheaper deal
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robs180 View Drop Down
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Posts: 23 		  Quote robs180 Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 2:25pm
and by gtx 470 and 480 outperforming a 5970 i mean 2  470's or 480's in sli. 
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Dragoonseal View Drop Down
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Posts: 2247 		  Quote Dragoonseal Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 2:45pm
Originally posted by robs180

so if gtx 470's  or 480's can outperform a 5970 4gb without being OC and costing 200$ or more less then why would anyone get it?

I ask this question all the time. Basically it's just people not doing their homework on things and falling for marketing.

The 5970s have always been horribly overpriced, especially the newer 4GB ones. On top of that quad Crossfire scaling is really bad so two 5970s (which is like 4 underclocked 5870s) perform just awful. We always try to steer people away from them, there are much better options.
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Posts: 4219 		  Quote !ender_ Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 3:06pm
the exact same reason that intel can sell the i7 930, 940, and 950
 
all of these are the exact same chip, intel just changed the multiplier! it takes 15 seconds do to and they charge multiple hundreds of dollars extra! rofl how this still works is so far beyond me
 
like dragoon said, great marketing and taking advantage of anyone who doesnt stop to ask what it is they are buying
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Posts: 5084 		  Quote justin.kerr Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 3:11pm
Originally posted by !ender_

5970 2gb = 2 x down clocked 5870s
5970 4gb = overclocked and overvolted 5970 with 2gb vram ddr5 added
 
 
no, no
5970 2gb is dual 1Gb 5870's down clocked to keep it under the 300 watt TDP maximum limit
5970 4Gb is  dual 2Gb 5870's down clocked to keep it under the 300 watt TDP limit.
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Posts: 4219 		  Quote !ender_ Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 3:40pm
if the 4b is still downclocked i blame the references for bad info
 
was one i used
 
Originally posted by bit-tech.net

After Sapphire’s tweaking and the addition of the massive cooler, these GPUs run at 900MHz, up from the 725MHz of a stock-speed HD 5970. This theoretically makes the Toxic comfortably faster than two HD 5870s (which share the same GPU and are clocked at 850MHz) in CrossFire. To achieve these clock speeds, Sapphire has had to increase the GPU’s voltage, and this has necessitated the two 8-pin PCI-E power connectors used to fuel this beast. Sapphire recommends an 850W PSU for any PC that includes the Toxic.

The doubling of memory from 2GB on the stock HD 5970 to 4GB also requires extra power. This is doubly true, as Sapphire has chosen to use twice the number of DRAM chips, rather than use higher density 256MB modules, with 16 chips on either side of the PCB. This has required a slight PCB reshuffle, as well as extra power phases compared to the typical HD 5970, but the stock HD 5970’s PCB is roomy enough to allow for the extra memory without issue. The memory has also been overclocked, from 1GHz (4GHz effective) to HD 5870 speeds of 1.2GHz (4.8GHz effective).
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justin.kerr View Drop Down
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Posts: 5084 		  Quote justin.kerr Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 3:51pm

that is a overclocked card,  so different specs. lol
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Posts: 2312 		  Quote ablahblah Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 3:57pm
if you're looking to get true double 5870 power on a single card, don't look at the 5970. it's double 5870, but underclocked. the only true double 5870 on a single pcb I think is the Asus ARES card, but really, are you gonna fork over that much $$$ instead of just getting dual 5870's in the first place? lol.
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Dragoonseal View Drop Down
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Posts: 2247 		  Quote Dragoonseal Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 3:58pm
Or better yet just getting a 480. Or two.

Or hell even just a 470, or two.
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Posts: 4219 		  Quote !ender_ Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 4:06pm
Originally posted by Dragoonseal

Or better yet just getting a 480. Or two.

Or hell even just a 470, or two.
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Posts: 4219 		  Quote !ender_ Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 4:25pm
if that sapphire card was OC that helps my suggestions even further, if 2x470s beats the overclocked one in multiple applications, then it would really be silly to get one of those in my opinion/assessment
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Posts: 5084 		  Quote justin.kerr Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 4:44pm

the 5970 was built for one reason, to say it is the fastest card out there.. yeah it does it, but it is not a card that I would ever recommend.

the higher Gb versions are intended for super high res like 5760x1600.  but even then only some games show any improvement with the extra Vram.
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robs180 View Drop Down
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Posts: 23 		  Quote robs180 Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 6:03pm
ah is see, thank you guys for clearing this up and explaining it to me.
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Cobra_mike View Drop Down
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Posts: 29 		  Quote Cobra_mike Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 11:07pm
Im still slightly confused, so would a single 470 or 480 be better then the 58702gb then? Im also building a rig, but im using a single card with with a ASUS VW266H 25.5" at 1920X1200 resolution, so im curious which would be the better card to use with that type of monitor. btw the cpu will be a core i-7 930. thanks
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Posts: 4219 		  Quote !ender_ Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 17 Aug 2010 at 11:12pm
Originally posted by Dragoonseal

Or better yet just getting a 480. Or two.

Or hell even just a 470, or two.
 
 
right here
 
 
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justin.kerr View Drop Down
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Posts: 5084 		  Quote justin.kerr Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 10:05am
Originally posted by Cobra_mike

Im still slightly confused, so would a single 470 or 480 be better then the 58702gb then? Im also building a rig, but im using a single card with with a ASUS VW266H 25.5" at 1920X1200 resolution, so im curious which would be the better card to use with that type of monitor. btw the cpu will be a core i-7 930. thanks
the 2GB 5870, is not really any better than the 1Gb. only a couple of games at super high resolutions 2560x1600+ will show any gain.
 
With all GPU's at stock settings, the GTX 470 is slightly behind the 5870, and the GTX 480 is around 15% faster than the 5870.. this is an average, for most games, and most reolutions, with max settings.  Turn off AA, and the 5870 is a head of the GTX 480 by around 5%. average. some games more, some games it still loses.
Overclocking, the GTX 470 gains the most in game performance, the GTX 480 is next, and the 5870 gains the least, out of the 3.
 
Driver wise, Nvidia has been producing very good, stable drivers, which they usually do, like all companies they make mistakes, and produce bad drivers, but mostly, they are very good with drivers, and current ones are good.
ATI, is all over the place, and have been for years. they offer monthly driver updates, instead of Nvidia, who releases a new driver when they need to, or they are ready, and each month is has been very hit and miss with ATI.  last couple of drivers have been very poor, so poor infact that I have had to use drivers that have been modified to get games to play perfectly.
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Cobra_mike View Drop Down
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Posts: 29 		  Quote Cobra_mike Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 19 Aug 2010 at 6:56pm
Awesome, thanks for the response Justin, that summed up what i was getting at. Also thanks for the response as well !ender.
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