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Ready at last ...

Post Date: 2010-08-06

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big bossman View Drop Down
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  Quote big bossman Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Topic: Ready at last ...
    Posted: 06 Aug 2010 at 6:06pm
Hi all,
Buying this coming week.  Started out about 3 weeks ago, then got diverted by rather pressing other matters now resolved.  The following build is what I've decided on after much looking.  Budget is  $2000-$2500 range, obviously lower the better.

Monitor was mentioned in a previous post, but it needs to be nice because of lot of graphic work and OLD eyes.

I do a lot of Illustrator, Photoshop, Flash, etc., type stuff, so I've  decided on an  SSD for apps.  I live in Sacramento - HOT in my work room, some dust.

This build owes much to digesting y'all's knowledgeable and enthusiastic comments.  Tear, rip, fire away!


Ticket Number: 429531
Total Price with Instant Savings: $2,305.00

Direct Load URL: http://www.digitalstormonline.com/comploadsaved.asp?id=429531

Specifications:
Chassis Model: Special Deal Hot Seller - Cooler Master CM Storm Sniper
Exterior Finish: - Standard Factory Finish
Trim Accents: - Standard Factory Finish
Processor: Intel Core i7 930 2.8GHz (Quad Core)
Motherboard: EVGA X58 LE Edition SLI (Intel X58 Chipset)
System Memory: 6GB DDR3 1600MHz Digital Storm Certified Performance Series  (Highly Recommended) (Hand Tested)
Power Supply: 750W Digital Storm Certified (Dual SLI Compatible) (Silent Edition Recommended)
Expansion Bay: - No Thanks
Hard Drive Set 1: Operating System: 1x (128GB Solid State (By: Corsair) (Model: CMFSSD-128GBG2D)
Set 1 Raid Options: - No Thanks
Hard Drive Set 2: Multimedia\Data: 1x (1TB Hitachi/Seagate (7200 RPM) (32MB Cache)
Hard Drive Set 3: Backup\Misc.: - No Thanks
Optical Drive 1: DVD-R/RW/CD-R/RW (DVD Writer 24x / CD-Writer 48x)
Optical Drive 2: - No Thanks
Internet Access: High Speed Network Port (Supports High-Speed Cable / DSL / Network Connections)
Video Card: 1x NVIDIA GeForce GTX 480 1.5GB (Includes PhysX Technology)
Add-on Card: - No Thanks
Sound Card: Integrated Motherboard Audio
Extreme Cooling: AIR: Stage 1: Noctua Dual 120mm Fans High Performance Cooler (Compatible With ONLY i7 Processors)
H20 Tube Color:- Not Applicable, I do not have a FrostChill or Sub-Zero LCS Cooling System Selected
Chassis Airflow: Standard Factory Chassis Fans
Internal Lighting: - No Thanks
Enhancements: - No Thanks
Chassis Mods: - No Thanks
Noise Reduction: - No Thanks
Boost Processor: FREE: Stage 1: Overclock the processor between 3.3GHz to 3.9GHz (Cooling Upgrade Recommended)
Boost Video Card: - No Thanks, Please do not overclock my video card(s)
Boost Memory: - No Thanks, Please do not overclock my memory
Boost OS: - No Thanks, Please do not tweak the services on the operating system
Windows
OS: Microsoft Windows 7 Professional (64-Bit Edition)
Restore Kit: Digital Storm Specialized Recovery System (DVD Image Based)
Virus Protection: - No Thanks
Office: - No Thanks
Benchmarking: - No Thanks
Install/Test Game: FREE: Hot-selling game with a NVIDIA GeForce GTS 250 or above graphics card
Display: - No Thanks
Surge Shield: - No Thanks
Speakers: - No Thanks
Keyboard: - No Thanks
Mouse: - No Thanks
External Storage: - No Thanks
Exclusive T-Shirt: FREE: Digital Storm T-Shirt -

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Dragoonseal View Drop Down
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  Quote Dragoonseal Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 06 Aug 2010 at 6:20pm
I think you're selling yourself short with that case. The HAF 932 will have better air flow.

You definitely don't want that SSD, it's very old and around 8 times slower than an Intel SSD in small file performance, probably the worst SSD that DS offers. Prices on it never came down like they should have, so an Intel SSD will not only have much better performance but also a very similar GB/$ price point. The Intel 80GB would be more than enough for all OS/apps, but the 160GB is another option if you need more room for games or something and want to splurge.

The only thing Windows 7 Professional offers that Home Premium does not is the ability to download and install XP Mode virtualization software. If you don't have a need for XP Mode then just drop down to Home Premium.

Those are the only 2-3 things I would change, otherwise the config looks good.
Lilim
Intel Core i7 920 @4.2GHz
HAF 932 - Dual SLI Nvidia GTX 480s
3x Intel X25-M G2 (80GB) SSD RAID0
R.I.P. Sinbad the cat (November 16, 1996 - April 18, 2011)
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big bossman View Drop Down
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  Quote big bossman Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 06 Aug 2010 at 7:19pm
Originally posted by Dragoonseal

I think you're selling yourself short with that case. The HAF 932 will have better air flow.

You definitely don't want that SSD, it's very old and around 8 times slower than an Intel SSD in small file performance, probably the worst SSD that DS offers. Prices on it never came down like they should have, so an Intel SSD will not only have much better performance but also a very similar GB/$ price point. The Intel 80GB would be more than enough for all OS/apps, but the 160GB is another option if you need more room for games or something and want to splurge.

The only thing Windows 7 Professional offers that Home Premium does not is the ability to download and install XP Mode virtualization software. If you don't have a need for XP Mode then just drop down to Home Premium.

Those are the only 2-3 things I would change, otherwise the config looks good.


Hey there, Dragoonseal,
I was thinking, perhaps incorrectly, that this case would be better for a dust prone environment, being more "air tight" as it were, and were it not for that annoying factor - dust - wouldn't have given much consideration to anything besides HAF 932.  Could you elaborate a bit?

Also, I'll bow to you about the 128 SSD.  Will perhaps just go for the 80GB as I had been leaning towards initially.  Haven't looked, but from your statement I'm just presuming I can get the "Intel 80GB" at DSO.

I picked Windows 7 Pro because I have some older apps, a bit reluctant to give up some of them.  I'll need to look into that further.  Monday - Tuesday at latest - is what I'm pushing for though.

THANK you very much!  I've  learned a whole lot from reading your posts alone, not to mention several others!

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Cretae View Drop Down
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  Quote Cretae Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 06 Aug 2010 at 7:36pm
There's nothing wrong with the airflow in a Sniper case, and it comes with an integrated very fine mesh that acts as dust filters without impeding airflow. It is not at all "airtight". There are large surfaces that are quite "open air", but they all possess the mesh. The HAF 932 is equally open air, and the fans are a little bigger, but there is no filtering at all. You have to go after-market for ones that fit.
For your concerns, I think the Sniper is the right choice.
 
 
Coolermaster Storm Sniper
Intel Core i7 930 3.8GHz OC
EVGA X58 LE
6GB DDR3 1600Mhz Ram
750W Corsair
1TB HDD
1x ATI RadeonHD 5870 1GB
Noctua Dual 120mm
I can make my mind think... anything....
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!ender_ View Drop Down
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  Quote !ender_ Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 06 Aug 2010 at 9:52pm
big boss, the sniper is almost just as open as the haf, as cretae said, currently the only decent closed air cases are i believe the 690 2 and the ravens
 
its such a comforting feeling seeing anyone pick a non intel SSD, you KNOW the next post will be dragoonseal busting out the beat stick
 
the xp compatibility is a bit misleading, its not intended for things like old apps and games, its designed for small businesses that designed programs specifically for xp, more than likely everything you want to use will work fine with 7. if youre concerned, google it first
 
i agree with the other posts, youre looking good
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bethel95 View Drop Down
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  Quote bethel95 Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 07 Aug 2010 at 1:37pm
I opted for the Storm Sniper over the HAF 932 and have been perfectly happy with it--no cooling issues, very roomy, and a lower profile to boot (which was an issue with my desk height and my desire to elevate the case on a stand). I've also liked the front external port locations, the manual case fan speed control, and the solid-as-a-rock case handles. Having dug around inside the 932 at a local store, the Storm Sniper also seems a bit more solidly-constructed inside to me.

Several points of consideration on your configuration:

(1) If you want to use a DS-supplied SSD, then Dragoonseal is probably right. If you feel competent installing drives yourself, then there are better options than any of the SSDs that DS offers (check the online reviews, especially at Maximum PC). With the advances in SSD technology over the past 6-9 months, even the Intel drives have their disadvantages, comparatively speaking.

(2) As for your mechanical HDD, spend the extra $26 for the WD Caviar Black--you'll get a faster drive than the Hitachi, and at least as good as the Seagate (or a lot better, depending on what Seagate they use). Personally, I'd consider the +$46 for the 64 MB cache WD Caviar Black to be the primo deal--wish they'd had that one when I ordered last March.

(3) So where can you save some money? Well, if you're really not going to use this rig for heavy gaming (you're claiming that it's for photo and video work), then you're wasting a lot of money on the GTX 480--you'll simply not get any performance bang for all those extra bucks (photo and video processing being first CPU-intensive and then hard on the RAM for larger files sizes; GPU is a factor only if you try to go low-end, where it can become a bottleneck). I spec'd my system for the same work, and I'd recommend getting the Radeon 5770 (more than enough for graphics work) and saving yourself $321. Feel free to talk to the DS techs about this--they'll tell you the same thing. Then you can feel totally not guilty about moving up to the WD HDD!

(4) Now that you've saved that money by right-sizing the GPU, consider putting a little of that back in to upgrade to a USB 3.0 / SATA 6GB/sec motherboard for future compatibility--either +$86 for the ASUS or +$103 for the EVGA (I'm not familiar with the MSI). I'm using the ASUS, and have had no problems with it (DS tests all the RAM slots during QA to ensure that none are DOA, which is the sole complaint about this board on Newegg review forum).

(5) The Noctua cooler you chose is certainly adequate, but doesn't give you much cooling headroom for future expansion/upgrades. If you're not comfortable with installing your own cooler, the +$55 for the Noctua NH-D14 would be a better bet. If you're OK with installing your own cooler, the Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus has tested better than either of the Noctua coolers, and costs only $30 (saving $58 from your current spec). See www.maximumpc.com/article/reviews/cooler_master_hyper_212_plus for a review.

On a side note, how about the Asetek twin-fan liquid CPU cooler? That's what's in my rig (I wanted the lower noise profile than the Noctua cooler, and didn't know about the CM Hyper Plus at the time), and I really like it (and this model has no history of leaking, despite what the haters say).

That said, I'd approach this cooler carefully, based on my experience with my configuration. The combination of the Storm Sniper case and ASUS mb doesn't leave enough clearance for the radiator to be mounted with stock 120x25mm fans--the radiator impinges on the ATX power connector on the mb by a full 5mm. DS found this out the hard way when they built my rig and shipped it to me with the ATX plug obviously bent down at an interesting angle.

In DS's  defense, my rig was their first build with this specific combination, and they went the extra mile to locate and ship to me two 120x20mm fans that would fit (no charge, though I had to do the mod myself). I can't recommend that you go that route unless DS agreed to set it up that way for you (which would require a bit of extra communication, as that's a custom mod). I'd be concerned about the Asetek cooler fit with the EVGA mb, too, unless DS can certify that they've done it and that it's not a problem. Given that the CM Hyper Plus cooler outperforms the Asetek twin-fan cooler, you're probably better off installing the CM cooler yourself, if you're inlcined to mess with anything.
bethel95
CM Storm Sniper
ASUS P6X58D
Core i7 930 (OC'd to 3.894 GHz)
6 GB RAM (3x2GB)
XFX Radeon 5770
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Dragoonseal View Drop Down
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  Quote Dragoonseal Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 07 Aug 2010 at 3:45pm
Originally posted by bethel95

(1) If you want to use a DS-supplied SSD, then Dragoonseal is probably right. If you feel competent installing drives yourself, then there are better options than any of the SSDs that DS offers (check the online reviews, especially at Maximum PC). With the advances in SSD technology over the past 6-9 months, even the Intel drives have their disadvantages, comparatively speaking.

You'd think right? Numbers wise there are only two real competitors to Intel SSDs, which are SandForce drives and Crucial RealSSD C300 drives. Taking a quick glance at performance numbers you might think both outperform an Intel, but alas, those fresh out of the box numbers are ever so deceiving.

The C300 is a quick scratch off the list, because its performance very quickly plummets to unacceptable levels without TRIM support, and even with TRIM it'll easily drop to 60% write performance and never recover. Read speeds are moot, because you have to run it on the Marvell controller to get anything higher than an Intel, but the Marvell controller has no TRIM so the C300's speed would bottom out.

Up until recently a close second choice for me would of been SandForce SSDs, higher price points than Intel but faster write speeds. But unfortunately in the last week or two I've found out a few unsavory enough things to also strike them off my list of "Better than Intel" drives.

For one they compress data on the fly as they write data. This has the great benefit of not only writing to the drive less but also significantly speeding up writing of compressible data. Sadly SSD benchmarks use highly compressible repetitive data and this gives SandForce SSDs inflated write speed numbers. This I've known for some time but lately I'm seeing more and more indications that their write speeds on non highly compressible data is actually fairly unimpressive. But worse is that I come across this thread, in which it is revealed that SandForce drives benchmark artificially high when brand new but within a few days once Garbage Collection has mapped the drive the controller's DuraClass technology will significantly limit/throttle the drives speeds and it will never recover back to the fresh out of the box speeds that only lasts for a few days.

Funny how they fail to mention that when advertising their performance numbers.

So no, Intel drives are currently still top dog. I do like the compression technology that SandForce drives have brought to the table though, it really opens the door to bettering future generations of SSDs.

(2) As for your mechanical HDD, spend the extra $26 for the WD Caviar Black--you'll get a faster drive than the Hitachi, and at least as good as the Seagate (or a lot better, depending on what Seagate they use). Personally, I'd consider the +$46 for the 64 MB cache WD Caviar Black to be the primo deal--wish they'd had that one when I ordered last March.

WD Caviar Blacks are a waste of money. Not even a 5% difference in performance between a 64MB cache Caviar Black and a more generic 32MB cache Seagate/Hitachi selection. The +$41 difference is much better spent elsewhere, such as more SSD space or something.

(4) Now that you've saved that money by right-sizing the GPU, consider putting a little of that back in to upgrade to a USB 3.0 / SATA 6GB/sec motherboard for future compatibility--either +$86 for the ASUS or +$103 for the EVGA (I'm not familiar with the MSI). I'm using the ASUS, and have had no problems with it (DS tests all the RAM slots during QA to ensure that none are DOA, which is the sole complaint about this board on Newegg review forum).

Ugh, no. You do not want a SATA III motherboard, at all, for any reason whatsoever. Marvell's fake SATA III controller is completely terrible, and so are the methods used to garner the bandwidth for it. You will not get 6Gb/s performance at all, see this thread for more detailed information.

On a side note, how about the Asetek twin-fan liquid CPU cooler? That's what's in my rig (I wanted the lower noise profile than the Noctua cooler, and didn't know about the CM Hyper Plus at the time), and I really like it (and this model has no history of leaking, despite what the haters say).

The Asetek Liquid CPU cooler is just LC for the sake of saying it is LC. It isn't exactly known for its construction quality or reliability either. Its cooling pales terribly compared to real LCing, even good air coolers such as either of the Noctua models offered by DS will outperform it.

It isn't the worst thing in the world, but considering the Stage 1 Noctua (NH-U12P) is almost the same price but cools better there really is no point to the Asetek. The Noctua fans are also amazingly quiet, noise is non issue. Select one of the Noctua coolers instead.
Lilim
Intel Core i7 920 @4.2GHz
HAF 932 - Dual SLI Nvidia GTX 480s
3x Intel X25-M G2 (80GB) SSD RAID0
R.I.P. Sinbad the cat (November 16, 1996 - April 18, 2011)
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!ender_ View Drop Down
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  Quote !ender_ Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 07 Aug 2010 at 8:14pm
boss i dont want to be an ass, but i dont consider most of bethels information very good, i dont want to go through doing a point by point denial, but a lot of the input is simply wrong, dragoon addressed some of it, but be careful who you listen to.
 
i dont read a lot of magasines, but i have looked through maximum pc's "pc builders bible" and i was not impressed, id look for better references
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big bossman View Drop Down
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  Quote big bossman Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 09 Aug 2010 at 8:49am
Hey all!  Many thanks to ALL who replied.  Advice appreciated greatly.  I'm placing my order today, pretty much as in my most recently posted config, with a couple of changes.

I will be buying another rig in a few weeks as well.  The particulars of that one will depend to some extent on the results of this one.  Thanks again.

Would have replied sooner, but away most of weekend, wife wouldn't allow netbook to be turned on!

Thanks again!
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